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[tools-yak@collab] I come for help with Xpertweb

To: tools-yak@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
From: Andrius Kulikauskas <ms@xxxxx>
Date: Sun, 06 Apr 2003 01:08:41 +0300
Message-id: <3E8F53E9.1000207@ms.lt>
Hi Eugene and all,    (01)

It looks like I'll get to do some work for http://xpertweb.com  Part of 
my job is to draw out expertise from people who are at the 
state-of-the-art-and-beyond regarding XML technology.  I thought this is 
the place to be, and am especially interested to learn more about Tom 
Munnecke's project.  I'll start by sharing my letter below, we'll be 
working openly at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/thinkingrelevantly/  If 
this is interesting, perhaps we can find various ways of worm-holing our 
work across our social spaces.  And I'm also interested how we might 
track how you are helping us, document that through the very reputation 
system that we are building, and look for ways that we all here might 
benefit.    (02)

Peace,
Andrius    (03)

--------------------------------------------    (04)

Wednesday I spoke with Mitch Ratcliffe to ask for advice how I might 
attend blogtalk.net, and he encouraged me to call Britt Blaser 
http://www.blaserco.com/blogs/ regarding his XpertWeb 
http://xpertweb.com   You may have seen, I had included in our 
"ideafeeds" an excerpt from our member Flemming Funch's lucid description at
http://ming.tv/flemming2.php/_d10/_v10/__show_article/_a000010-000668.htm
which I'm now reproducing in full further below.    (05)

Britt and I spoke for about an hour, and it looks good that I can do 
about a total of $2,000 of work for him in April and May and also attend 
http://blogtalk.net  He'll be able to tell me quite soon.  Meanwhile, 
he's accepted my offer of membership to our laboratory in recognition of 
his open source initiative, XpertWeb.  I've signed him up here with us, 
welcome, Britt!    (06)

I then spoke with Flemming, who is the architect/designer/coder for 
XpertWeb, taking this up as a labor of love.  Flemming is an 
accomplished developer/manager and has for many years dreamed of and 
created what is now called "social software".  He is excited about 
XpertWeb, which I understood from him is a protocol for transactions 
that encourage providers and clients to meet each other half-way and, in 
the long run, benefit from a transparent network of reputations. I 
myself am especially excited by their idea that this network of 
reputations can include work for free, and in fact, help such lead to 
work for pay.    (07)

My job is to assist Flemming, especially by attracting and organizing 
people who could share their state-of-the-art thinking on XML 
technology.  We will also see what coding tasks (PHP and XML) might be 
handed over, for example, here in Lithuania.  However, Flemming is 
looking for the solution that is right because it is elegant. I have a 
friend who likes to garden and talks of putting a 50 cent plant in a 50 
dollar hole, rather than the other way around.  In other words, we're 
looking for a small bit of code/data in the right big picture.  I sense 
that the biggest help that I (and we) can offer Flemming is to inform 
him of the dimensions of the big picture that the XpertWeb may at some 
point have to be adjusted for, so that his code can allow for 
modification along the key parameters.    (08)

Britt has thought through in extensive detail the social workings of his 
system.  My first task will be to absorb this all, and regurgitate it. 
He has papers at http://xpertweb.com and a training module for 
participants in the XpertWeb Co-Op  It's very exciting that many of the 
key ideas behind his system are the same as we found in our paper "An 
Economy for Giving Everything Away" 
http://www.ms.lt/en/workingopenly/givingaway.html (which also includes 
thoughts on six marktes for open source software, and look up also the 
grand daddy AMIX, The American Information Exchange.) Britt's come up 
with a market that is quite similar to what we've set up at 
http://www.ms.lt/serving.html (which I could possibly work under). He's 
pushed much further in this direction, especially bringing out the key 
role of reputation.  What we're now doing is trying to implement his 
system truly, simply and quickly.  We need to distinguish what are the 
key principles, and what is his "aesthetic intuition" that fleshes out 
the bones.  We need to implement that as a starting point from which to 
experiment, until we find the expression for Britt's system that is 
morally attractive, socially viral and economically sound.    (09)

As part of this, Flemming and I envision "exercises" that we could 
conduct with PHP to get a real sense of what works socially.  This can 
include simple things like synchronizing Wiki pages that might stand for 
people, offerings, requests, agreements.  We might use this to track our 
own work together, who is helping who.  That might actually be helpful 
for keeping on track of this project, which can benefit and suffer from 
distractions.    (010)

We'll also be looking for "application spaces" where this system might 
be worked out.  That might be something that I can pursue with 
http://blogtalk.net in mind.  My paper "The Algebra of Copyright" might 
actually suggest ways that there could be an economy of sharing 
micro-content.  Regardless, when I go I will be able to try to locate 
niches where this system, or subsystems, might be placed.    (011)

It's fantastic that this whole project is intended to be open, and we'll 
be able to work on it openly at our ThinkingRelevantly working group. I 
am excited that we might find synergies with other projects of our 
members.  I think is especially important in exploring what different 
kinds of business models might be.  For example, Flemming and I talked 
about how Britt's system might work with an alternative currency for 
which an investor might buy options to the rights to exchange for real 
currency.  In this way, each micro-payment would be worthless in real 
money, but the macro-aggregate, backed up by the community, would have 
real value.    (012)

I love Britt's theme that currently, money has too high of a clotting 
factor.  His system intends to loosen up money so it could circulate 
more rapidly. (And I note that good is slack.) I think of corporations 
as those hardened cultures that are too successful at making money, and 
have trouble putting it back to sensible use.  I imagine that somehow 
this "clotting problem" relates with the Cluetrain-like team-building 
services that we're developing http://www.ms.lt/team/ for linking 
corporate thinkers with those outside.    (013)

This is truly amazing that we can all work together.  I hope this 
happens.  I'll start by sharing this letter at our lab's general group 
Minciu_Sodas_EN@yahoogroups.com, and our working group Thinking 
Powerfully for "tools for thinking", and also at Blue Oxen Associate's 
mailing list tools-yak@collab.blueoxen.net for that's the place I know 
that I can find state-of-the-art-and-beyond XML expertise. Monday, I'll 
start going through all of Britt's writings, and sharing that at 
ThinkingRelevantly.    (014)

Peace,    (015)

Andrius    (016)

Andrius Kulikauskas
Minciu Sodas
http://www.ms.lt
ms@ms.lt
+370 (5) 2645950
Vilnius, Lithuania    (017)

------------------------------------------------
Xpertweb 2003-03-17 23:59 by Flemming Funch
------------------------------------------------    (018)

So, what is Xpertweb ? In simple terms, it is a way for people to offer 
their services and products, for a suggested fee, or even for free if 
they choose, and for others to know with a high level of confidence what 
they can expect to get. Services are offered by arranging for certain 
files to be found on one's website. Files that identify you as a vendor 
of services, and that lists what products are available. The files are 
stored in a standardized XML based format. But at the same time they can 
be customized for the special needs this vendor has. The files are 
publically visible over the web. The software tools are open source. 
There is no centralized authority, no centralized storage place for the 
information. But it can be aggregated by anyone, in many inventive ways. 
And it can be validated by anyone, to verify that it is in a correct 
format and that it looks complete.    (019)

There is then a standard protocol for carrying out a transaction. A 
prospective buyer/recipient of the offered service/product will select 
what he would like. He might go through some custom steps to negotiate 
options, scheduling, special requirements, etc. The customer places the 
order. The provider accepts the order. All information about all of this 
gets stored in a standardized, publically visible XML format. The 
information about all steps of the transaction gets stored on both the 
provider's and the customer's computers/servers.    (020)

The provider provides the service asked for. The customer rates how 
satisfied he is, on a percentage scale. If he is less than 50% 
satisfied, he will pay nothing. If he is more satisfied than that, he 
will pay in the ratio of his level of satisfaction. All of this 
information is stored with both the provider's and the customer's data. 
It is public. There are ways of checking whether anybody tampers with it.    (021)

This is an infrastructure for peer-to-peer economic interaction. Most 
important aspects about it, besides that there is no central control, is 
that everything is rated and everything is public. So, reputation 
becomes very important, and you can't fake it, because it is detectable 
when you do. Prospective customers can examine what previous customers 
experienced with a certain vendor. A vendor can examine what a 
customer's previous track record is. And they can decline on a given 
transaction.    (022)

Certain relationships are built-in. Both providers and customers have 
mentors, who both might act as helpful consultants in making this all 
work, but who also serve a function in letting their software verify and 
aggregate activity for the people they have sponsored. That introduces 
some checks and balances that makes the system more fault-tolerant, and 
that fosters synergetic relationships.    (023)

It all doesn't exist yet. But Britt Blaser has spent several years 
thinking it through in great detail, and building prototypes. Now it 
just needs to be made as simple, compelling, transparent and 
bullet-proof as possible. Some data structures need to be finalized. 
Some initial sample software needs to be written. It needs to be tried 
out with real people.    (024)

It might be huge.    (025)


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